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Huh? 996 GT3's sold for around $120K, I see them now for around $70K, that's almost a 50% drop in 4 years, doesn't sound like they are holding their value to me, if anything the 997 GT3s being better than the 996's have caused the prices on 996's to drop a fair amount.
Not to be a jerk or anything Ken as you know how I feel towards PCNA right now, but my Cayman S has dropped 50% in two years. Yes, I know that I'm Canadian and was stupid enough to trust Porsche to look after it's Canadian customers, but Kor is also Canadian, and I feel that he has a point. Our market up here is much different than yours. Plus, many of you will change your tune if Porsche ever drops your prices the way that they did ours.
Not to be a jerk or anything Ken as you know how I feel towards PCNA right now, but my Cayman S has dropped 50% in two years. Yes, I know that I'm Canadian and was stupid enough to trust Porsche to look after it's Canadian customers, but Kor is also Canadian, and I feel that he has a point. Our market up here is much different than yours. Plus, many of you will change your tune if Porsche ever drops your prices the way that they did ours.
Great advice all! CS and 6GT3 are the only two cars I can fit in. So 997S is out. I agree that mechanically it is not a fair comparsion.
A very low mileage '07 CS with PASM and SC can be had for +/- $52kUS. I know of two sub 1,000 mile '04 996GT3s that have sold for $80kUS LAST summer. So for me that is the high water mark for a cream puff.
From the feedback I have gotten so far a CS is a better car to learn in for a couple of seasons of modest track usage. The 6GT3 is the car to get if I can afford the upfront cost, can accept that it is riskier to learn in and harder to be fast in right away, and the car to get if I want a car I can use on the track for many seasons without any mods whatsoever.
Is that a fair sumation?
Chris
PASM - Porsche Active Suspension Management
This active damping system offers continuous adjustment of individual damping forces based on current road conditions and driving style.
The driver can choose from two setup modes, ‘Normal’ and ‘Sport’, using a separate ‘damper’ button on the center console. ‘Normal’ mode is designed for general road driving and circuits with uneven tarmac. ‘Sport’ mode is intended for smoother track surfaces, where the harder settings help eliminate pitch and roll.
In either mode, PASM continuously evaluates the current conditions while automatically selecting the corresponding damper rates from the respective set of mapped values.
A range of sensors are used to monitor the movement of the body under acceleration, braking and cornering maneuvers, as well as on poor road surfaces. The PASM control unit then evaluates this data and modifies the damping force on each individual wheel in accordance with the selected mode. The result is a significant reduction in body movement as well as a better grip on the road.
For example: if ‘Sport’ mode is selected, the suspension is automatically set to a harder damper rating. If the quality of the track surface falls below a certain threshold, the system immediately changes to a softer rating within the ‘Sport’ setup range. When the quality of the tarmac improves once more, PASM automatically returns to the original, harder rating.
Need more information about PASM? Click this link: FAQ for PASM
Hi Chris, I don't understand your comment why the 997S is out. If you can fit in a 987 you can fit a 997. As well, you should consider a 997s. If you are importing, that might be the best bet of all price wise. As well, if your upgrade plans are still the same after 2 years the 997S might keep you happy for longer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CGF
Great advice all! CS and 6GT3 are the only two cars I can fit in. So 997S is out. I agree that mechanically it is not a fair comparsion.
A very low mileage '07 CS with PASM and SC can be had for +/- $52kUS. I know of two sub 1,000 mile '04 996GT3s that have sold for $80kUS LAST summer. So for me that is the high water mark for a cream puff.
From the feedback I have gotten so far a CS is a better car to learn in for a couple of seasons of modest track usage. The 6GT3 is the car to get if I can afford the upfront cost, can accept that it is riskier to learn in and harder to be fast in right away, and the car to get if I want a car I can use on the track for many seasons without any mods whatsoever.
Is that a fair sumation?
Chris
PASM - Porsche Active Suspension Management
This active damping system offers continuous adjustment of individual damping forces based on current road conditions and driving style.
The driver can choose from two setup modes, ‘Normal’ and ‘Sport’, using a separate ‘damper’ button on the center console. ‘Normal’ mode is designed for general road driving and circuits with uneven tarmac. ‘Sport’ mode is intended for smoother track surfaces, where the harder settings help eliminate pitch and roll.
In either mode, PASM continuously evaluates the current conditions while automatically selecting the corresponding damper rates from the respective set of mapped values.
A range of sensors are used to monitor the movement of the body under acceleration, braking and cornering maneuvers, as well as on poor road surfaces. The PASM control unit then evaluates this data and modifies the damping force on each individual wheel in accordance with the selected mode. The result is a significant reduction in body movement as well as a better grip on the road.
For example: if ‘Sport’ mode is selected, the suspension is automatically set to a harder damper rating. If the quality of the track surface falls below a certain threshold, the system immediately changes to a softer rating within the ‘Sport’ setup range. When the quality of the tarmac improves once more, PASM automatically returns to the original, harder rating.
Need more information about PASM? Click this link: FAQ for PASM
Hi Chris, I don't understand your comment why the 997S is out. If you can fit in a 987 you can fit a 997. As well, you should consider a 997s. If you are importing, that might be the best bet of all price wise. As well, if your upgrade plans are still the same after 2 years the 997S might keep you happy for longer.
Ken I would love a 997S as I have two wee ones that I would love to be able to take on weekend drives. But I barely fit a 997S without a helmet due to the sunroof. With a helmet on I have to assume an uncomfortable posture and the mirror obstructs my vision on right hand turns. I spent two days in 997s and 997Ss at PSDS in January. The fit isn't something I could live with all the time on the track and I fear it might affect my ability to drive safely once the going gets faster and the driving more agressive than the lead follow of PSDS. I've attended two DE events as a spectator and sat in just about every modern Porsche with a helmet on including a 997GT3 with a thinner Recaro seat than the factory seat - no dice. My best fit option is a 996GT3 as it does not have a sunroof and the Cayman. As much as I love the only no sunroof 997, the 997GT3RS, it is more than I am willing to spend, I hate paying a premium for anything, and it is way too much car for a newbie like me.
CGF; do you want to win or just play on the track? If you want to win, a mid engine has advantages a rear engine will never have (Ferrari showed that this season in GT2), but modding will be necessary. That's the cold hard truth. If you just want to play, again you should get a CS because it is cheaper and much better looking inside and out.
__________________
996 GT3 lower control arms at all corners
997 GT3 front sway bar
Tarett rear toe links
Quaife TBD
DMC harness bar/G-force harness
CGF; do you want to win or just play on the track? If you want to win, a mid engine has advantages a rear engine will never have (Ferrari showed that this season in GT2), but modding will be necessary. That's the cold hard truth. If you just want to play, again you should get a CS because it is cheaper and much better looking inside and out.
I'm only going to be doing DE events, no races, so the only "winning" will be against how I choose to measure myself. Be it being waved by the car ahead, a better lap time, or taking a corner better than I ever have before.
Man this is hard! I know I need to learn momentum driving but the appeal of the raw power of the 6GT3 appeals also. From the feedback to date I am leaning towards a CS for 1-2 seasons. Then who knows, 6GT3, or the 7GT3 or RS that I really covet.
Thanks- where are the bushings you speak of? Do you press out the bushing in the center of the 996 GT3 control arm where it connects to the diagonal arm? What about where the diagonal arm mounts to the body? What about the rubber where the LCA meets the body? How does that feel on the street?
I think we nearly hijacked the CS-GT3 thread. (sorry guys)
I probably need to post a few articles on all the mods I have done AND look in the Porsche Manual for the correct names for all the parts. I did look in the manual and found that some of the names I used might have been wrong. So here is a recap of the bushing changes. I tried to use all Porsche parts in my mods where I could.
On the front:
I replaced the "trailing arm" (aka: Diagonal Arm) with the 996/997GT3 arm. The primary suspension bushings are in 2 places. Both are where the suspension attaches to the frame. Top monoball bushing is in the GT3 camber plates that I installed. Bottom Tarret monoball is at the frame to "lower control arm" pivot point. I also rotated and repressed the bushing where the trailing arm connects to the lower control arm.
While the feel is really improved, all that rubber does allow toe and camber flex, making turn ins and steering corrections slower.
On the rear:
I replaced the "toe link assembly" with the 996/997GT3 part. Rotated and repressed the bushing in the lower arm where it connects to the toe link. Installed a Tarett monoball bushing at the frame/arm connection point.
ARTICLES
__________________ CaymanS Track Videos 2004 996GT3 / 2007 CaymanS / 2008 SLK350 / 2007 Cayman S Track Car (Modified with parts from: 997GT3, 996GT3, 997GT3RS, Porsche Motorsport, Tarrett, Mantis, Arlan, AP Racing, Moton, Eibach, Tubi, Aasco, Sharkwerks, Quaife, TC Design, Heigo, Fikse, Softronic, TeamTech, Traqmate, SVtek, ChaseCam, Pagid, Rennline, Hooiser, Motul) Complete Mod List and Setup Info
More hijacking... Glenn, you're car looks awesome. I have a black CS and I really with that mine was silver or white. Your car is the first black Cayman that I think looks better than silver!
Quote:
Originally Posted by glenn
I think we nearly hijacked the CS-GT3 thread. (sorry guys)
I probably need to post a few articles on all the mods I have done AND look in the Porsche Manual for the correct names for all the parts. I did look in the manual and found that some of the names I used might have been wrong. So here is a recap of the bushing changes. I tried to use all Porsche parts in my mods where I could.
On the front:
I replaced the "trailing arm" (aka: Diagonal Arm) with the 996/997GT3 arm. The primary suspension bushings are in 2 places. Both are where the suspension attaches to the frame. Top monoball bushing is in the GT3 camber plates that I installed. Bottom Tarret monoball is at the frame to "lower control arm" pivot point. I also rotated and repressed the bushing where the trailing arm connects to the lower control arm.
While the feel is really improved, all that rubber does allow toe and camber flex, making turn ins and steering corrections slower.
On the rear:
I replaced the "toe link assembly" with the 996/997GT3 part. Rotated and repressed the bushing in the lower arm where it connects to the toe link. Installed a Tarett monoball bushing at the frame/arm connection point.
Linear Mode
