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I'm looking to get a Porsche primarily for DE events. My only track experience is 2 days at PSDS. So I am pretty much a rank novice. Budget is $80k but the intial outlay is not as much of a concern to me as the total cost of ownership (depreciation, repairs, consumables etc) over 2-3 seasons.
Option #1 is a used '07 or '08 CS with PASM & Sport Chrono. I will do no mods. I'll learn with it for 2-3 years and upgrade to a new DFI CS or 997GT3/RS once they are more reasonably priced. I love the look of the CS and how unflappable it is to drive. I know it will get more use off the track.
Option #2 is a 996GT3. Add Euro GT3 seats and a half cage and go. Visually is does nothing for me. I'm told the street manners are tiresome so it will likely get less use than a CS. It might be a car I can keep for many years however. But looks wise I covet the 997GT3/RS, I just don't want to pay the premium they are at today.
I know either car will exceed my skills for years and years and be a blast to drive. So what do you think I should do? I need a car by May!
Chris
PASM - Porsche Active Suspension Management
This active damping system offers continuous adjustment of individual damping forces based on current road conditions and driving style.
The driver can choose from two setup modes, ‘Normal’ and ‘Sport’, using a separate ‘damper’ button on the center console. ‘Normal’ mode is designed for general road driving and circuits with uneven tarmac. ‘Sport’ mode is intended for smoother track surfaces, where the harder settings help eliminate pitch and roll.
In either mode, PASM continuously evaluates the current conditions while automatically selecting the corresponding damper rates from the respective set of mapped values.
A range of sensors are used to monitor the movement of the body under acceleration, braking and cornering maneuvers, as well as on poor road surfaces. The PASM control unit then evaluates this data and modifies the damping force on each individual wheel in accordance with the selected mode. The result is a significant reduction in body movement as well as a better grip on the road.
For example: if ‘Sport’ mode is selected, the suspension is automatically set to a harder damper rating. If the quality of the track surface falls below a certain threshold, the system immediately changes to a softer rating within the ‘Sport’ setup range. When the quality of the tarmac improves once more, PASM automatically returns to the original, harder rating.
Need more information about PASM? Click this link: FAQ for PASM
Sport Chrono and Chrono Plus
This optional package is a valuable addition for trackday use. Available in conjunction with the CDR-24 CD radio, it includes a swivel-mounted analog and digital timer unit which is centrally located on the dashboard. All functions are easily accessible via the control stalk for the on-board computer. Analog dials measure hours, minutes and seconds, while a separate digital field displays whole seconds, tenths and one hundredths of a second. A second digital display runs in parallel in the instrument cluster. Click this Link to visit the FAQ entry for Sport Chrono.
DFI
Direct Fuel Injection (DFI), is a new technology that Porsche states can cut fuel consumption by up to 15 percent, while increasing power by up to 13 percent. DFI cuts emissions by warming up the catalytic converter more quickly, and ensures a sharper throttle response. Better for your right foot - and the planet, then.
DFI allows much more precise measurement of fuel supply and injection at pressures up to 120 bar; it has numerous combustion modes, with different cycles for cold-starting, low-speed driving and performance driving.
As the name suggests, DFI injects fuel directly into the individual combustion chambers, instead of the intake manifold. The injector valves have an electromagnetic mechanism that controls each injection with astonishing precision, while a high-pressure pump provides the necessary pressure—up to 1,740 psi—to accompany the rapid fire of the fuel injection.
Precise geometry of the injector’s position and its spray pattern is a key factor in helping to improve power, torque and emissions of the engines. The specific placement of the fuel as it enters each chamber creates a swirl that improves the air/fuel mixture, and therefore the overall combustion process.
At engine speeds up to 3500 rpm, a double-injection process is used. In this mode, the required fuel volume is delivered in two successive injections per working stroke. The resulting benefits include faster catalyst warm-up and increased torque in the upper load range.
By forming the air/fuel mix directly in the combustion chamber, DFI contributes to engine cooling. As a result, it is possible to increase the compression ratio and with it the power and efficiency of the engine.
The direct injection process is continuously adjusted. The engine management system reads changes to throttle inputs and performance requirements and, as you drive, the air/fuel mix is monitored and adapted as required. Oxygen sensor circuits within the exhaust system provide accurate emissions control.
ask mooty....and go to the 996gt3 forum on rennlist. nice 996gt3s are getting rarer and the buyin is much higher but they will hold their value much better than the CS. both are pretty bulletproof on the track. more importantly IMHO the gt3 is that much more of a special, charismatic car that will prob hold your interest for years...as a novice the rational choice for you would be the CS.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CGF
I'm looking to get a Porsche primarily for DE events. My only track experience is 2 days at PSDS. So I am pretty much a rank novice. Budget is $80k but the intial outlay is not as much of a concern to me as the total cost of ownership (depreciation, repairs, consumables etc) over 2-3 seasons.
Option #1 is a used '07 or '08 CS with PASM & Sport Chrono. I will do no mods. I'll learn with it for 2-3 years and upgrade to a new DFI CS or 997GT3/RS once they are more reasonably priced. I love the look of the CS and how unflappable it is to drive. I know it will get more use off the track.
Option #2 is a 996GT3. Add Euro GT3 seats and a half cage and go. Visually is does nothing for me. I'm told the street manners are tiresome so it will likely get less use than a CS. It might be a car I can keep for many years however. But looks wise I covet the 997GT3/RS, I just don't want to pay the premium they are at today.
I know either car will exceed my skills for years and years and be a blast to drive. So what do you think I should do? I need a car by May!
Chris
PASM - Porsche Active Suspension Management
This active damping system offers continuous adjustment of individual damping forces based on current road conditions and driving style.
The driver can choose from two setup modes, ‘Normal’ and ‘Sport’, using a separate ‘damper’ button on the center console. ‘Normal’ mode is designed for general road driving and circuits with uneven tarmac. ‘Sport’ mode is intended for smoother track surfaces, where the harder settings help eliminate pitch and roll.
In either mode, PASM continuously evaluates the current conditions while automatically selecting the corresponding damper rates from the respective set of mapped values.
A range of sensors are used to monitor the movement of the body under acceleration, braking and cornering maneuvers, as well as on poor road surfaces. The PASM control unit then evaluates this data and modifies the damping force on each individual wheel in accordance with the selected mode. The result is a significant reduction in body movement as well as a better grip on the road.
For example: if ‘Sport’ mode is selected, the suspension is automatically set to a harder damper rating. If the quality of the track surface falls below a certain threshold, the system immediately changes to a softer rating within the ‘Sport’ setup range. When the quality of the tarmac improves once more, PASM automatically returns to the original, harder rating.
Need more information about PASM? Click this link: FAQ for PASM
Sport Chrono and Chrono Plus
This optional package is a valuable addition for trackday use. Available in conjunction with the CDR-24 CD radio, it includes a swivel-mounted analog and digital timer unit which is centrally located on the dashboard. All functions are easily accessible via the control stalk for the on-board computer. Analog dials measure hours, minutes and seconds, while a separate digital field displays whole seconds, tenths and one hundredths of a second. A second digital display runs in parallel in the instrument cluster. Click this Link to visit the FAQ entry for Sport Chrono.
DFI
Direct Fuel Injection (DFI), is a new technology that Porsche states can cut fuel consumption by up to 15 percent, while increasing power by up to 13 percent. DFI cuts emissions by warming up the catalytic converter more quickly, and ensures a sharper throttle response. Better for your right foot - and the planet, then.
DFI allows much more precise measurement of fuel supply and injection at pressures up to 120 bar; it has numerous combustion modes, with different cycles for cold-starting, low-speed driving and performance driving.
As the name suggests, DFI injects fuel directly into the individual combustion chambers, instead of the intake manifold. The injector valves have an electromagnetic mechanism that controls each injection with astonishing precision, while a high-pressure pump provides the necessary pressure—up to 1,740 psi—to accompany the rapid fire of the fuel injection.
Precise geometry of the injector’s position and its spray pattern is a key factor in helping to improve power, torque and emissions of the engines. The specific placement of the fuel as it enters each chamber creates a swirl that improves the air/fuel mixture, and therefore the overall combustion process.
At engine speeds up to 3500 rpm, a double-injection process is used. In this mode, the required fuel volume is delivered in two successive injections per working stroke. The resulting benefits include faster catalyst warm-up and increased torque in the upper load range.
By forming the air/fuel mix directly in the combustion chamber, DFI contributes to engine cooling. As a result, it is possible to increase the compression ratio and with it the power and efficiency of the engine.
The direct injection process is continuously adjusted. The engine management system reads changes to throttle inputs and performance requirements and, as you drive, the air/fuel mix is monitored and adapted as required. Oxygen sensor circuits within the exhaust system provide accurate emissions control.
I have to disagree that the 996 GT3 is a much better car, given that the build quality of the CS is identical to the 997 GT3 and the CS has a newer interior than the 996, etc. The only thing better is the adjustable bits you can easily/cheaply add to the much better looking CS, and the engine. Does anyone disagree with that?
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996 GT3 lower control arms at all corners, 997 GT3 front sway bar
H&R rear sway bar, Tarett rear toe links
Quaife TBD
DMC harness bar/G-force harness
GT3 is a much better car, holds value, worth way more, faster, etc.
Huh? 996 GT3's sold for around $120K, I see them now for around $70K, that's almost a 50% drop in 4 years, doesn't sound like they are holding their value to me, if anything the 997 GT3s being better than the 996's have caused the prices on 996's to drop a fair amount.
Faster? I haven't had a single 996 GT3 pass me at the track. Ever. Granted my car is modified and sure the 996 GT3 is faster than a Cayman S in stock form, but my mods are a lot less than the price differential between the two cars so I would argue that you can easily turn a Cayman S into a 996 GT3 beater.
I think for the individual asking the question the Cayman S is a better car. If he catches the track bug he can modify the Cayman S (still have a warranty) and have a newer and more improved track weapon, and one less likely to do him bodily harm if he gets it wrong. I too also found the 996 GT3 tiresome for regular day to day driving, repeated kidney punches were not my cup of tea.
I'm thinking more inline with wpmjr
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The looks inside and out of the 996's never flicked my bic but seriously, as a track car the 996 GT3 is just plain faster, and more trackable straight from Porsche. From memory, more ponies (380hp), LSD, and adjustable suspension, all things the Cayman still lacks stock. Of all the 996s the GT3 still looks good too.
The CS is a great car and looks a generation better than the 996, but it doesn't take anything away from it to admit that there are other great and possibly better cars available depending on what you expect from it.
Everyone raves about Sport Chrono, but it's the only option that I consider a waste of money. I even have the additional gizmos SC has associated with PCM, never touch them, useless info, useless chronometer, silly artificial feeling throttle map.
Sport Chrono and Chrono Plus
This optional package is a valuable addition for trackday use. Available in conjunction with the CDR-24 CD radio, it includes a swivel-mounted analog and digital timer unit which is centrally located on the dashboard. All functions are easily accessible via the control stalk for the on-board computer. Analog dials measure hours, minutes and seconds, while a separate digital field displays whole seconds, tenths and one hundredths of a second. A second digital display runs in parallel in the instrument cluster. Click this Link to visit the FAQ entry for Sport Chrono.
LSD - Limited Slip Differential
A limited slip differential (LSD) is a modified or derived type of differential gear arrangement that allows for some difference in rotational velocity of the output shafts, but does not allow the difference in speed to increase beyond a preset amount. In an automobile, such limited slip differentials are sometimes used in place of a standard differential, where they convey certain dynamic advantages, at the expense of greater complexity.
The main advantage of a limited slip differential is found by considering the case of a standard (or "open") differential where one wheel has no contact with the ground at all. In such a case, the contacting wheel will remain stationary, and the non-contacting wheel will rotate freely– the torque transmitted will be equal at both wheels, but will not exceed the threshold of torque needed to move the vehicle, thus the vehicle will remain stationary. In everyday use on typical roads, such a situation is very unlikely, and so a normal differential suffices. For more demanding use however, such as driving off-road, or for high performance vehicles, such a state of affairs is undesirable, and the LSD can be employed to deal with it. By limiting the velocity difference between a pair of driven wheels, useful torque can be transmitted as long as there is some friction available on at least one of the wheels.
To see the installation of a TBD style unit Click Here
To see the installation of a LSD style unit Click Here -> Article Forthcoming Stay Tuned
Last edited by consolidated; 02-29-2008 at 04:24 AM.
I'm not sure how much looks will factor into your purchase, but I never cared for the interior of the 996s. I test drove one back to back with the CS and it just seemed "drab" to me.
If depreciation is not a factor, the CS should be your pick hands down. The GT3 may depreciate percentage wise less, but may turn out to be more of a dollar amount. Even with the depreciation, you may be better of with the lower initial "investment" (I use that term VERY loosely) even if it doesn't hold it's value as much.
As great of a car as the GT3 is, the mid-engine platform will always be better, especially if you decide to mod it.
I can assure you, if you go with the CS, you will drive it on the road much more then you plan. It is a pure joy to hop into every morning.
Either way my friend, you are in a great position. Take the next couple months, drive each, and find the exact car you want.
Thanks guys! I hope I get more from those who have owned both and perhaps tracked both. If Mooty or Joel-CS are out there I would love to hear them chime in.
I wish I could drive both before having to decide. But I need to have a car by the end of May. I will most likely import from the US into Canada. So I won't have a chance to experience each car on a track before making my purchase decision.
Until 
