OK, this one is for you track junkies. I'm in Zone 1, close to Limerock. My car should be here soon, but probably not in time for this DE season. So I'd like to get started next spring. I want to run my car stock for a while, get to know it. I know I'm going to need a fire extinguisher, so I'm planning on installing the Porsche part. No problem.

I have done a couple of events way back in the early 90s, but I am considering myself a total novice and know that I need to start at the very beginning. I want to learn how to drive this car right.

Can someone explain the groups and nomenclature to me? I recall there were five groups, labeled with colors. What are they? When do you solo? How long does it take the average driver to graduate from one group to the next? What kind of goals should I give myself.

I heard that Joel-cs and Jayman really tear up Limerock. You guys have any advice for me? Are there any instructors that really know the Cayman and are good with newbies?

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Gator Bite
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I have been to 3 DEs (6 days) so I'm not an expert, but I'll give you my thoughts until someone more advanced responds.

Different regions appear to have different rungroups. In Memphis, we have novice, intermediate, advanced, and instructor. The StLouis PCA had those and one more (which I can't remember). After you have enough experience and your instructor is comfortable with you, they will sign you off to solo. My understanding is that once you are signed off to solo on a particular track, you can solo for future events. An instructor may need to verify your competence before letting you solo at a future event (this part is unclear to me).

I have moved very quick through the ratings. The most important thing to remember is that you need to be comfortable with the advancement. In my case, I spent two DEs in novice and was promoted to intermediate. After another DE, I was signed off to move to advanced. That said, I can't say that I am comfortable running my CaymanS in that rungroup yet. Rules tend to be very strict on passing in novice. They lighten up a bit in intermediate. They lighten up a lot in advanced. For example, they will designate certain areas of the track for passing. They may say that between turns 3/4 and 1/2 are passing zones for novices. They will add another area or two for intermediate, etc, etc. Although they aren't supposed to, I've seen advanced drivers passing in the corners, which I am not comfortable exposing my CaymanS to.

I was told by my last instructor that any student may run in a lower class. I've registered for my next DE as advanced, but will run in intermediate if I become uncomfortable. I would strongly recommend getting an instructor with a Cayman or a Boxster. I learned more in my track time with Dan (STLPCA), than I have in either of my other DEs.


Anyway, hope that helps FWIW.

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"The Cayman doesn't need any more toys." -- My wife

I've done 2 Porsche DE, and 2 club events, so 6 track days. I too started at novice and moved quickly up. Check your local PCA DE rules, they will list the colors. Here is a link the PCA in the SF Bay Area, with a good description of DE's. PCA GGR: Time Trialing with GGR


Smounic raises a good point about being comfortable in your group. Our PCA is incredibly safety conscious, and I've not yet seen any car-to-car contact. But its a very personal decision.

I prefer to be on the slower end of a faster run group: otherwise you get held up by the slower drivers, and spend more time in the congo line than on open track.

I don't think you need an instructor with a Cayman or Boxster for the first couple of events. In these you'll still be working on the basics, like driving the line, adjusting your braking zones, etc. and any instructor can help on these points. None of my instructors had Caymans, and all of them provided valuable insight and instruction.

I don't think it is necessary, but it is nice. My first instructor had a 944, second a CaymanS, and third a 964 911. I found myself underwhelmed by the 944, and impressed by both the 911 and the CaymanS. I have to say that the way that the 911 danced through the curves because of the rear weight was almost like a ballet. You are probably correct, in that a person my be too overwhelmed to begin with to worry about the car model

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"The Cayman doesn't need any more toys." -- My wife

Gator if you are attending a CVR-PCA De event they pretty much spell it out here, http://www.cvrpca.org/de/forms/06_de_guide.pdf They explain the different run groups, as a matter of fact at this link they explain the whole event pretty throughly.

Lime Rock is a fine track to learn on, its all corners so you are kept pretty busy. The condition of the track is poor compared to a few others I've been to but its in your back yard, might as well get some experience there.

I cannot believe anyone can move from Novice to advanced in 3 events unless your Micheal Shumacher. I can tell you it ain't gonna happen at CVR-PCA and thats a good thing. Green run group is novice and you will be there at least for 3 events and they don't like moving anyone up unless they have been on more than one track, in other words, 3 events in the green group at LRP might not get you into the yellow run group until you have done the Glen or Tremblant. You should be heel/toe down shifting consistently and competently, consistently hitting all your apexs, not be distracted by cars passing you and staying on the "line" to get signed off to solo in the yellow run group. This means you can do events from here on without an instructor. You might be able to solo for a session or two if your instructor feels your ready.

The CVR-PCA has a reputation for being conservative in advancing students but that also means its safer and you are more likely to drive your car home after the event, unscathed. I have had about 7 events with Trackmasters, which is also an excellent school with an excellent reputation and they won't advance a student from novice to intermediate until the student has had a minimum of 3 DE events.

Read the info at the link I included above and all your questions will be answered regarding DE events with the local PCA club. Yes LRP is a rough track but its a good track to learn your fundamental on. Lets face it, anyone can go straight fast, its the corners.

Jim Bryant from Apex-SPG helped me get fitted for my helmet for my first DE (two weeks from now). He gave me this handy checklist.

I have found my local PCA to be very friendly and encouraging as I get ready. Jim too!

DFogal.

Attached Files

Track Check List v3.doc (45.0 KB, 38 views)

Oh yeah - here's the abbreviate list. The full list includes some things that are probably not relevant.

Attached Files

track list shortened.doc (31.5 KB, 23 views)

Gator - looking forward to getting you out to the track! If you want to go to Lime Rock, your best bet is a CVR event, as Jayman indicates. The instructors are excellent and the events are extremely well run and, most importantly, safe. In addition to an extinguisher, you should read some of the other threads on this forum about prepping for your first track day, as well as the link that Jay posted.

I would also recommend showing up at an event to see what it is all about. The next one is next Fri-Sat with CVR at LRP. Come on out!

If you want to go to the Glen, Trackmasters runs a great program and does focus quite a bit on classroom education and debriefing your track time, something you don't see as much in PCA. Some find it very helpful.

As far as run groups and advancement, it is fine to ask the questions now, but don't ask your instructors! Everyone likes to set goals and advance, but if your instructors sense that this is the reason you are there, they will not take kindly to it. Better to ask friends and colleagues at the track their impressions...

That being said, advancement really depends on how quickly you "take" to being on track and how often you go. People advance at very different rates and you will have to find a pace that you are comfortable with. I have met people that have been doing DE's for 5 years and are still in yellow and know someone that went from green to black in one year (but they did 40 events!). (CVR run groups are green/yellow/yellow solo/white/black/red-instructor.) Smoothness, ability to play nice with others on track, situational awareness, etc all play into it. Bottom line is both you and your instructor will know when the time is right to advance. Most regions are good about this, as they don't want large differentials in speed within a run group.

Come out next weekend and introduce yourself. #733.

PS - I heard from a friend that there were at least 8 Caymans on track today at Lime Rock!

Gator
DE programs vary from Region to Region, so your specific questions are best answered by those familiar w/the Regions running DEs at LRP.

That said, here in STL, we run 5 goups: Novice, Intermediate, Intermediate-Advanced, Advanced & Instructor. However, depending on # of entrants, car mixes, etc, we may have overlaps. Instructors are mandatory for the 3 less experienced groups, although a student may get signed off to solo towards the end of the weekend. Every Advanced student has an assigned instructor for help if desired. We have a few experienced Nationally competitive SCCA drivers as "guest instructors" for advanced students & instructors who desire top level instruction. In short, we focus on driver improvement & education.

Progress is highly individualized, but it would generally take a novice at least 4-5 years of steady progress & regular DE participation to move into our advanced group. We have written criteria for specific skills, track awareness, safety concerns & driving maturity to move up the ranks based on evaluations by the student's instructors.

Our local track (Gateway) can be unforgiving of driver errors so passing for all groups is point by in designated areas. We are intolerant of "hot dogs" & have sent drivers home early. So, know the group you run with before taking liberties with the rules.

Sonny - thanks for the nice comments. As you know, the STL Region runs a well organized DE program & we work hard to provide our students w/a fun, safe, & educational weekend. We strive to have instructors who want to instruct, not just get free track time. Almost all (soon