Dear Unregistered, the permission changes should be complete, if you notice any issues with your access on the site please let us know and we will check into it.
Hey Unregistered it seems that you haven't posted a message in our forums yet. Please join in on the fun and post a message!
Dear Unregistered,
We've noticed that you are not yet a member of our Cayman Insiders group. This group provides a number of additional value-add services via this website for a very low annual fee. You can find out more about this group here:
Insider Announcement
You can join the Cayman Insiders Group here:
Insider Enrollment Form
We hope to see you "Inside" soon!
Cayman CompetitionAuto Cross, Club Racing, DE, this is the place to discuss the Cayman on the track
Your Donation Will Be Used To Pay For our ever increasing bandwidth costs, our hosting Service, domain registration, software licensing fees, maintenance costs and product evaluations Only!
Please enter your donation amount above, and then click on the donate button below.
I thought we were talking about mods allowed in classes, not cars themselves.
But why should cars be classed based on ability alone? Member appeal most definitely should be part of classing, IMHO. "Member appeal" means a LOT of things, but definitely includes things like cost and contingency. People used to hate to autocross the Neon, but Dodge paid so much money that the car became appealing anyway. One particularly freakish talent won something like $35k in a single season of autocross in one, in fact. There were other cars believed to be more competitive in that class, but nobody even tried them. The Neon was too popular thanks to contingency. Note that the SCCA didn't favorably class that car due to popularity, either. People just ran it anyway.
But if a car might just barely be an overdog for a class yet be a has been in the next up class and end up in that next up class. Why? Lots of reasons...it might be deemed that it is just too expensive for most members to want (and lack contingency and any of the other things that might get people to buy it anyway). Why does that matter? Because it would only take one person regularly showing up in that car to kill participation in the class otherwise. Then that one guy wins a championship in it against nobody. And now the class may as well not exist as it only serves on member. Makes no sense to let that happen.
Same with allowing mods that would price people out of being able to play competitively in particular classes. If the FSP guys all had to have custom LCAs made to be competitive, a LOT of them would find something else to do outside of Solo, I'd imagine. Just doesn't make sense.
--Donnie
That's called the tyranny of the majority, and however it's rationalized it is ugly. You are happy to skew the rules to screw the minority and please the majority- and that undermines any credibility anyone ever subscribed to the SCCA as being about fair competition. It is really about class politics and delivering victories to politically powerful members or member-blocs. Rather than making specious arguments at every turn you should just admit that.
Say: "Yes that caster argument against LCA's was pure BS, just as was the phony evaluation I did on the CS. We have a ton of members who have mazdas, mitsubishi's and hondas. Our number one job is to guard their flank and keep them happy. We thought about renaming our organization the Mazmitsonda racing club, but changing the letterhead cost too much..."
But don't try to tell me I ever asked for special treatment. I want a fair playing field.
__________________
996 GT3 lower control arms at all corners
997 GT3 front sway bar
Tarett rear toe links
Quaife TBD
DMC harness bar/G-force harness
That's called the tyranny of the majority, and however it's rationalized it is ugly. You are happy to skew the rules to screw the minority and please the majority- and that undermines any credibility anyone ever subscribed to the SCCA as being about fair competition. It is really about class politics and delivering victories to politically powerful members or member-blocs. Rather than making specious arguments at every turn you should just admit that.
Say: "Yes that caster argument against LCA's was pure BS, just as was the phony evaluation I did on the CS. We have a ton of members who have mazdas, mitsubishi's and hondas. Our number one job is to guard their flank and keep them happy. We thought about renaming our organization the Mazmitsonda racing club, but changing the letterhead cost too much..."
But don't try to tell me I ever asked for special treatment. I want a fair playing field.
Okay, so first you dismiss my arguments with no actual counter point in the debate as "BS", then you claim my CS evaluation was "phony"? Why don't you add in something criminal or talk about my mother while you're at it?
The Cayman S is in SS, a class where an Elise, Z06 (two different generations), and Porsche 996 GT3 can all win (and have proven so). The Cayman is in AS, a class where the S2000, C4 Corvette, Porsche 993, Subaru STi, and Solstice GXP have all proven they can win. I'd say those classes serve a damned lot of members very well. The class you are arguing to be part of, ASP, has been won in recent years by GT2's, Z06's, and several other cars.
Look, we have little choice in autocross but to live in a system where we have to put things into a finite amount of classes with a finite set of rules. Every allowance you make in a category must be considered for the ramifications it will have on participation. After all, the SCCA is a CLUB and as such has but one goal, to do what it can to best serve the needs of the membership. But no rules-making body can control a ruleset to a degree of detail that it would let EVERY car be completely competitive. As one of a few volunteers who work on the SEB, I can say with some certainty that we give WAY more of our time trying to make the classing system better for as many members as we can rather than just a small set of groups. I really couldn't give a **** if you believe me at this point or not...all you'll do is wave your hands again that you're being unfairly picked on somehow because of the choices *you* have made within that structure.
If you want a system that's in some way significantly better, you're talking about per-car rule allowances like Pro racing series have (which sometimes just include weight penalties and such, but they are still per car allowances). The current volunteer nature of the Solo side of the club just doesn't allow for the manpower to maintain that. The only way it could would be for autocross prices at SCCA events to go up to the point that nobody would pay it anyway so that paid full time staff could do it.
Tyranny of the majority? Man, that's awesome rhetoric. I can't recall anyone's life being ruined by SCCA Solo classing, but it's a neat idea nonetheless.
I had new 996 GT3 lower control arms, a new 997 GT3 front sway bar, and new Hoosier A6's to go with my quaife unit already installed. That may sound like a lot of equipment, but it really just amounts to adding decent negative camber in front, a TBD, and good tires to our cars (I really haven't dialed in the sway bar yet).
The result? I ran as fast as the FM cars- those are little open-wheeled mini-formula 1-looking jobs that aren't street legal. Only a cm car (similar formula-car-non-street-legal layout, don't know the differences compared to fm cars) with a national champ driver beat me. Nothing with doors beat me. Other drivers included aces who go to divisionals and nationals too.
Whoo-hoo!
wpmjr: I assume the Hoosier A6's are designed for Autocross and the R6's for road course. What size did you go with front and rear? Also, do you drive on them to the AX or bring them with you somehow?
Thanks
LSD - Limited Slip Differential
A limited slip differential (LSD) is a modified or derived type of differential gear arrangement that allows for some difference in rotational velocity of the output shafts, but does not allow the difference in speed to increase beyond a preset amount. In an automobile, such limited slip differentials are sometimes used in place of a standard differential, where they convey certain dynamic advantages, at the expense of greater complexity.
The main advantage of a limited slip differential is found by considering the case of a standard (or "open") differential where one wheel has no contact with the ground at all. In such a case, the contacting wheel will remain stationary, and the non-contacting wheel will rotate freely– the torque transmitted will be equal at both wheels, but will not exceed the threshold of torque needed to move the vehicle, thus the vehicle will remain stationary. In everyday use on typical roads, such a situation is very unlikely, and so a normal differential suffices. For more demanding use however, such as driving off-road, or for high performance vehicles, such a state of affairs is undesirable, and the LSD can be employed to deal with it. By limiting the velocity difference between a pair of driven wheels, useful torque can be transmitted as long as there is some friction available on at least one of the wheels.
To see the installation of a LSD style unit Click Here -> Article Forthcoming Stay Tuned
__________________ '07 Cayman S (The Black Pearl) Performance mods: clear side markers
wpmjr: I assume the Hoosier A6's are designed for Autocross and the R6's for road course. What size did you go with front and rear? Also, do you drive on them to the AX or bring them with you somehow?
Thanks
I have 245/40's and 275/35's. My AX's are usually 20 miles away, and I've been driving on them to the event. I am going to Texas this weekend so I've mounted them on the roof rack, like was described in another post by arcticsilver.
__________________
996 GT3 lower control arms at all corners
997 GT3 front sway bar
Tarett rear toe links
Quaife TBD
DMC harness bar/G-force harness
As A/Xers out there have seen, mid engined cars typically do the best of any vehicle out there - that is why 914s are multi-time champions.
..and why a Cayman kicks butt!
__________________ Craig 425-765-1090, www.Rennstore.com --assistance & discussion for your pad selection welcomed PAGID brake pads - Daytona winners in every podium position E-mail for any questions: Rennstore@Comcast.net
__________________ Craig 425-765-1090, www.Rennstore.com --assistance & discussion for your pad selection welcomed PAGID brake pads - Daytona winners in every podium position E-mail for any questions: Rennstore@Comcast.net
Along with BSP if I read it correctly... now this might be an interesting class for the CS... especially if the AWD cars were reclassed
Donnie- can you confirm the BSP classing for Cayman S?
EDIT: OK - I just reread Aug-Nov Fasttracks and see nothing, but I could have swore there was a 1/1/08 recommendation to move ALL Boxsters and Caymans from ASP to BSP...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pupton
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pupton View Post
Donnie- can you confirm the BSP classing for Cayman S?
There was a proposal and the result will be announced in the next few weeks. I can't really say more than that.
Did this potential class change ever go anywhere?
__________________
2006 Arctic Silver CS with SRP and LSD
