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I promised a report on "YourPrivateTrackDay" at Thunderhill and how my 2.7 faired. This was my 3rd time at Thunderhill, and it was HOT. The water temp stayed center dial all day... not a problem -- and this was compared to a BMW M5's headgasket that let loose, causing a spin out of T13! Other DNF's: an Audi TT, a WRX... and a F430 who left after one session (and one spin -- too bad, he would really benefit by doing the full day to get more confortable with his truely capable equipment!)
A couple Boxters and one other Cayman (S), a lot of "911s" and a bunch of Corvettes, one Lotus, a hand full of prepred Miatas, WRXs, and some RS4 Audis -- as well as a bunch of other odds and ends. I ran Pagid Orange pads (Rennstore) and they were more capable than I am a driver. On a couple occassions, I braked hard at what I recalled were the brake points with my OEM pads.. only to find myself slowed down so quickly I coasted into the corner.. Kinda embarassing really.
Here's the deal though.... I passed a bunch of cars, a bunch passed me. BUT, the revelation was that one of the lead instructors took out his KIA (sports) sedan ... and once I came up to a group that he was in... he was not the slowest in the group. I mean in the turns, he had the outside shocks totally compressed and the inside shocks appearing to be totally extended... leaning so much that it looked like his passager was there just for balast (like a sailboat racer!). The darn thing was bobbing and drifting along, leaning like it was ready to tip over.. but he was keeping up!! As things spread a bit and I went to pass him on T7 (almost redline 3rd gear) I didn't feel snobbish at all... he showed me that a good driver can make almost anything go. This is a thought for the 2.7 vs CS debate... I bet that guy could jump into my 2.7 and drop 20 seconds off my "best" time --- and blow me away if my car magically turned into a CS. And if he jumped into a CS... watch out anything!!
Shows that we need to learn to drive whatever we have better !! That's my story -- and I'll stick to it!!
D of D&D>
Last edited by D&D; 05-17-2008 at 01:53 AM.
Reason: spelling
"I ran Pagid Orange pads (Rennstore) and they were more capable than I am a driver. On a couple occassions, I braked hard at what I recalled were the brake points with my OEM pads.. only to find myself slowed down so quickly I coasted into the corner.. Kinda embarassing really."
Right on
They are quite a bit higher friction than stock and are a LOT more capable than OEM.
(You have the factory GT3 ducts @ $30 per side, correct?)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
**A new Porsche is literally THE most durable showroom stock trackable vehicle made**
__________________ Craig 425-765-1090, www.Rennstore.com --assistance & discussion for your pad selection welcomed PAGID brake pads - Daytona winners in every podium position E-mail for any questions: Rennstore@Comcast.net
"I ran Pagid Orange pads (Rennstore) and they were more capable than I am a driver. On a couple occassions, I braked hard at what I recalled were the brake points with my OEM pads.. only to find myself slowed down so quickly I coasted into the corner.. Kinda embarassing really."
Right on
They are quite a bit higher friction than stock and are a LOT more capable than OEM.
(You have the factory GT3 ducts @ $30 per side, correct?)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
**A new Porsche is literally THE most durable showroom stock trackable vehicle made**
I ran the event with OEM ducts.. My GT3 ducts arrived in the mail today... so, will install for the next event... D
That is really kinda how my DE went...I passed by a few, and got passed by a few. Although there was a section at our local track that few if any could hang with me in the Cayman. I just need to work on threshold braking in order to increase my time spent WFO on the straights.
The Pagid's are on my get list, as are several other items. I totally agree that our 2.7's are very capable on the track. Way I see it is, I saved enough cash in buying the 2.7 to do $10k worth of track mods and DE events. Very happy with my 2.7!
I just completed my first DE at Pocono North and was very pleased with the performance of my 2.7. My instructor said the car felt very planted, I had a little understeer at spots on the track known to induce it. I'm running the 18" Cayman S Wheel with Michelin PS2 Tires. I had quite a bit of pressure gain when hot. I was shooting for 38F and 39R hot which seemed about right. I checked my pressures cold this morning and they were about 32F and 33R. We had heavy rain in our second session yesterday, and I was extremely impressed with the performance of the tires in wet conditions
To all, I appreciate your consideration on this, my first post. I'm an active member of Triumph Motorcycle and Miata enthusiast groups, and now looking to join the Cayman nation. I am looking for a track weapon that can be driven to and from, and the Cayman is the ticket. Of course, I've bumped up against the base v. S issue. I know you have covered this exhaustively, but here's the deal: can a base Cayman and a few grand in upgrades satisfy the track needs of a moderately skilled driver? I'm a member of the Drivers Club at NJMP, 50 years old, and ready to take the plunge. I'm just finding some great deals on used base models, and don't want to miss the forest for the trees. A few inputs from those with perspective would be appreciated, and I hope to be on the board as an owner shortly. Many thanks.
To all, I appreciate your consideration on this, my first post. I'm an active member of Triumph Motorcycle and Miata enthusiast groups, and now looking to join the Cayman nation. I am looking for a track weapon that can be driven to and from, and the Cayman is the ticket. Of course, I've bumped up against the base v. S issue. I know you have covered this exhaustively, but here's the deal: can a base Cayman and a few grand in upgrades satisfy the track needs of a moderately skilled driver? I'm a member of the Drivers Club at NJMP, 50 years old, and ready to take the plunge. I'm just finding some great deals on used base models, and don't want to miss the forest for the trees. A few inputs from those with perspective would be appreciated, and I hope to be on the board as an owner shortly. Many thanks.
I think you need to put the HP question in perspective......
No matter how much power you have, there are going to be people with more. In our June Road Atlanta DE, one guy brought in is 962 (no kidding, full Rothmans livery and all), trumping all the GT3s and Turbos! Then you get the 700 HP super charged vipers, Z06s etc. You'll never win the HP game.
A 2.7 Cayman has about the same power and weight as one of the most tried and true track rat cars, the E36 M3, and will out handle it to no end. And, most older 911s can't come close to keeping up with a Cayman unless they are highly modified.
And depending on where you drive, unless you have a lot more power, it may really not make that much difference. A well driven spec Miata or CooperS will hang with many higher HP cars on the right track.
But, if you can drive a 250hp car at 10/10ths all the time, maybe you do need more power, or like many of us, just want it because.........
Regards!
Jim Ellis Porsche
Porsche.... The driving experience is utterly unlike any other. When it comes to the finest in workmanship, technology, and exclusivity, there is no competition. Along with our certified sales professionals, we have the most highly trained service technicians in the industry. Most importantly, after 24 years with Porsche, we have a long history of customer loyalty and commitment to customer care that sets us apart from the crowd. We relish selling and servicing one of the most desired brand names in North America, Porsche. We welcome you and we hope you enjoy your visit - virtual or preferably, in person! We look forward to seeing you.
I think you need to put the HP question in perspective......
No matter how much power you have, there are going to be people with more. In our June Road Atlanta DE, one guy brought in is 962 (no kidding, full Rothmans livery and all), trumping all the GT3s and Turbos! Then you get the 700 HP super charged vipers, Z06s etc. You'll never win the HP game.
A 2.7 Cayman has about the same power and weight as one of the most tried and true track rat cars, the E36 M3, and will out handle it to no end. And, most older 911s can't come close to keeping up with a Cayman unless they are highly modified.
And depending on where you drive, unless you have a lot more power, it may really not make that much difference. A well driven spec Miata or CooperS will hang with many higher HP cars on the right track.
But, if you can drive a 250hp car at 10/10ths all the time, maybe you do need more power, or like many of us, just want it because.........
Regards!
Thanks for the thoughtful and quick response. I'm not going to have HP envy with uber-cars. Hell, i have a Miata now and love it! I'm just looking at cost/ benefit analysis and whether the base Cayman wheezes when pushed in a track setting. I favor balance and momentum when it comes to the sport.
Jim Ellis Porsche
Porsche.... The driving experience is utterly unlike any other. When it comes to the finest in workmanship, technology, and exclusivity, there is no competition. Along with our certified sales professionals, we have the most highly trained service technicians in the industry. Most importantly, after 24 years with Porsche, we have a long history of customer loyalty and commitment to customer care that sets us apart from the crowd. We relish selling and servicing one of the most desired brand names in North America, Porsche. We welcome you and we hope you enjoy your visit - virtual or preferably, in person! We look forward to seeing you.
Capo, I've been running a base 2.7 at NJMP since it opened, once at Lightening and twice at Thunderbolt. The base car does very well there, sure, some with more HP will be passing you on the front straight but not pushing you too much anywhere else. I'm running Michelin PS2 tires on 18" wheels with a track alignment (as much as you can get with stock parts) and Hawk HT-10 brake pads and the low cost GT-3 brake ducts. I'll be at Lightening either 10/31 or 11/1 ( I just requested the Advanced day 10/31, not yet confirmed). Stop by and we can talk about it Red Cayman probably #36
I drive the 2.7, bone stock except for Pagid Orange pads, CS's 18 in wheels and Bridgestones. Just got back from Thunderhill in N. Calif.
As mentioned, more horsepower (and maybe the different rations for the 6 speed) in the CS gives it more capability on the track -- period. But, for DE's that I go to and plan to go to, being the "fastest" in the session is not the point. I'm still in the Beginner/Intermediate group, but now can easily keep up with most any other and higher horsepower cars in this group -- I mean keeping up with a Viper for several laps (until he spun out at Turn 11-12) shows that its drving skill that makes the difference.
I jumped in with the Advanced group in the PM and a friend in his Corvette (running R compound tires) easily could go by me. We did a lead-follow and his comment was that I was doing well but would need more hp to go faster. Well, duh! The point was that the 2.7 was fun to drive and allowed me to get "driver educated".. and I have yet to hit all 15 corners correctly in a single lap --- maybe even in an "eclectic lap" .
So, to the original intent of this thread, IMO, the 2.7 is a worthy track toy that offers tons of capability with which you can develop driving skills. And for the street, who can use even 50% of any Porsche? D
IMO if you are as happy as you say you are with the Miata you will be even more happy with the 2.7. My GF is wanting a roadster and we went to test drive a bone stock 2008 MX5 and it wasn't near as good as expected.
On the Cayman vs CS issue, the 2.7 is an awesome street car, on the track the CS is $$ well spent. If you are thinking 2.7 or nothing then you cant go wrong with a base model. Now a days I'm seeing CS's in the $40k range and that just wasn't avalible a year ago. Having owned a 2.7 for about a year now, I have no plans to upgrade anytime soon, just enjoying the hell out of the 2.7 every chance I get.
Awesome car you have there!
D