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Old 06-26-2008, 05:52 AM
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Thunderhill Track Day Report (long)

This past weekend we (myself and my wife Maureen) went out with Northern California Racing Club, at Thunderhill. Slikgator was there as well.

NCRC runs a very laid back but pretty well organized event. I spoke with Dave Mills, who runs the club, about the differences between NCRC and Hooked on Driving. According to Dave, NCRC focuses more "upmarket" in terms of experience and speed than HOD. Whereas HOD is pretty restrictive on point bys and passing, NCRC is more liberal. HOD runs 3 to 4 groups, and even the advanced group is only allowed point bys in just a few sections of the track, whereas NCRC allows point bys full track, and runs a pretty liberal open group as well. The "limited" group in NCRC, which one would think would be novices is more like the B group for HOD. So keep that in mind when choosing which clubs to run.

That said, there was a LOT of action this weekend, with 3 car fires, 1 headon collision, and no small number of spins and other excursions (including this driver).

The car fires resulted apparently from the extremely hot and dry weather, the combustible combination of a very hot car going off and coming to rest on very dry grass. Oh, and the Ferrari F335 during the lunch race sessions who's engine caught fire. And then there was race prepped Viper which went off, and completely ripped off the left rear quarter panel from the car. She (yes she) was not in the Sunday lunch race.

The head on was a serious deal, but no one was hurt, except 200k in cars, a nicely modded 98 M3 (Avus Blue, what shame to lose) and a GT3 RS--that's right.

I spoke with the M3 driver, and his story was this: coming out of Turn 8 and heading up to Turn 9 (for those who don't know TH, 8 is a fast left sweeper, which leads uphill to 9, which is a steep, left, uphill blind crest, scary but hugely satisfying when done right) he noticed his oil pressure light on, and the gauge at 0. Not good. He looked down at the gauge for wee bit too long and when he looked up, he was deep into 9. He tried to turn in but too late, and spun, and ended up going backwards and mostly off track near the top of 9. He was thus stopped on the visible side of 9 at the outside edge of the track, near the outer berm, with the car partly on, partly off track.

He was there several seconds, 8 or so he says, and sees two cars coming. The first car sees him and takes tight line on 9 staying midtrack.

The second car is the GT3. He's right on the front car's tail (perhaps trying to pass?). He goes wide (which is the faster line), and too late sees the M3 and tries to avoid. The GT3's front and right side hit the full front of the M3. Game over for both. . The talk in the paddock was that the GT3 was following too closely and not looking ahead, since the M3 was on the visible side of 9, and the first car did see him and avoided him. I did not speak to the GT3 driver so I don't know his side of the story--and there's always two sides. Nonetheless, the chief steward did make an announcement afterwards that everyone should keep their eyes up and not follow too closely.

As I hinted above, NCRC events include a lunch time race session. A 12 lap race with everything from a Formula Ford (won Saturday, retired Sunday) to Cup cars, Vipers, Ferraris, and then Honda Civics, Minis, and a Formula Vee ("Wait for me!!!!" you could practically hear him scream with all 68 hp). This was great to watch from the 4th floor observation deck. The duals between the Cup cars, and between the Vipers and Corvettes were riveting. Lots of great passing moves coming off the drag race down the front straight into Turn 1. A spectacular save by a yellow 911 who was being chased by a red 911 only a car length behind: the yellow 911 got two wheels off the shoulder coming out of Turn 1 into Turn 2 (probably doing 90-100), but held onto it and got back on without getting passed.

Another great pass: Two Cup cars where running nose to tail for several laps. Up comes a race prepped Corvette. All three come out of Turn 15 onto the front straight, with the Corvette in 3rd place. The front Porsche stays left, the second Porsche edges right to pass. But wait! The Corvette stays left, and with that huge motor slips between the two Cup cars, passing the second Porsche seemingly unawares. Into Turn 1 the Porsche has the lead, with the Corvette and the secondPorsche two abreast, but the front Porsche goes wide, and Corvette moves inside and passes him as well. The Vette went on to win that day's event. Nice driving!

My laps were not nearly so exciting. For the first time since I've had the car, I've regretted not having the manual. . The Tip does not respond "correctly", and frankly makes it harder to know what gear your in, since there's no physical representation (via the sensory input of where the shifter is). Ahh well, just have to live with it. Some folks here have said that in Manual mode, the Tip will upshift by itself--I did not find this to be the case. I did learn to do the bypass without braking or slowing (turn in slightly before the crest), and turn 9 on the outside fast line.

But the best moment was this: Of course when tracking you are always watching the corner workers, looking for flags. You've got flags on the brain: red, black, yellow, meatball. So here I am riding with a coach (Andrew Block, great guy, excellent coach). We're coming out of Turn 1 into Turn 2. There's worker station on the outside of the track in between these two turns. Right as we pass the worker station, POOOF!!! a big red cloth thingy bursts onto Andrew's lap. WTF!! I'm red flagged? The worker threw the flag into the car?!?!? How the hell? Andrew picks it up and hold it out in front of him. Its a red Thunderhill T-shirt that my wife bought before the session and threw into the back of the car. The wind must have picked it up and pulled it forward. We both just crack up.

Later I had words with Maureen, like "You could have killed me if that wrapped around my helmet." "Darn...."

We're heading back to TH in July. I hope to have a Miata for Maureen by then. Yes, a Miata. Supercharged (170hp, maybe 190hp, 2200lb, do the math). Cheaper and more plentiful than M3s....let alone Porsches. I can get a supercharged 95-99 with <100k miles, with a setup suspension for <10k. I think of its as a reducing my carbon footprint.

Finally: got dyno'd at TH on a Dyno: 255hp at the rear wheels. Will post soon.
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Old 06-26-2008, 01:52 PM
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Wow!

Great writeup and some scary moments for some of the other drivers.

Thanks for sharing!
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Old 06-26-2008, 05:55 PM
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Awesome report.

The E36 M3 has an issue with a nut that comes off and disconnects the oil pump...no oil pump, no oil pressure. I wonder if the Avus M3 had this happen.

Any E36 M3 that is driven on a track should have this nut secured. One spin in the car that results in the car moving backwards while still in a forward gear and you can be set for trouble. Just a bit of trivia.

A bit more serious than a puff of smoke or two, eh?

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Old 06-26-2008, 09:09 PM
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I run with HOD and NCRC among numerous other NorCal groups. And your comparison of the two group is right on.

The viper that gone off was a viper competition coupe, not street legal. She’s with NCRC often, hopefully she will be back soon.

With regard to the race, the yellow 911 with a great save was being chased by a BLACK (not red) 996GT3 driven by a former caymanite, Bob.

There was only ONE cup car. The other was a street 996GT3 driven by me, the car in front during most of the race. I tried very hard and held the cup car off for 11 laps, but the last lap he outdragged me into T1 by ¼ length and shut the door on me. Oh well, there’s always next time.

The corvette is a tube frame chassis, probably 600+ hp. He really messed with me and the cup car. We were having a ball until the vette showed up.

Andrew is a great coach. He taught me how to drive.

video here: YouTube - ARC Thunderhill Race 6_22_08
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Old 06-27-2008, 03:35 AM
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One of the things I really like about NCRC is that you can drive in two run groups, the one you sign up for and the one just below (if there is room and there always seems to be lots of room). So, you can get double the track time compared to most other organizations.

I was there last weekend also, with my Boxster S. Several of us from the Seattle area make it down (700 miles) to Thunderhill a few times a year, and usually with NCRC due to the liberal passing rules and extra track time. Always a great trip. Too bad about the carnage this time around; it isn't normal.
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Old 06-27-2008, 04:21 AM
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Originally Posted by sleepless View Post
One of the things I really like about NCRC is that you can drive in two run groups, the one you sign up for and the one just below (if there is room and there always seems to be lots of room). So, you can get double the track time compared to most other organizations.

I was there last weekend also, with my Boxster S. Several of us from the Seattle area make it down (700 miles) to Thunderhill a few times a year, and usually with NCRC due to the liberal passing rules and extra track time. Always a great trip. Too bad about the carnage this time around; it isn't normal.
it was great seeing the NW contingent. i see the seal gray GT3 several times this year already. i got 218 miles on day one and 200 miles on day two
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Old 06-27-2008, 08:44 PM
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Who's typically liable in this type of two-car crash on a private track? Is it a "no fault" kind of think or is car that clearly hit the other accountable?
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Old 06-27-2008, 09:57 PM
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Who's typically liable in this type of two-car crash on a private track? Is it a "no fault" kind of think or is car that clearly hit the other accountable?
I think in California they allocate liability by relative negligence. The M3 driver should not have been distracted by the indicator light an the GT3 driver should have seen the other car and/or not been passing aggressively on blind corner when car on front was offline / behaving oddly. For good measure, the track, the organizers, BMW and Porsche would probably get dragged in if big $$ were at stake.

Since it was not a race, hopefully the two insurance companies will simply duke it out. I assume the M3 will come out fine, but the RS guy will get screwed because insurance company won't want to pay replacement value (MSRP+$40K or whatever), they will want to pay a depreciated value (MSRP - 25%).

-Chris
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Old 06-28-2008, 02:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mooty View Post
it was great seeing the NW contingent. i see the seal gray GT3 several times this year already. i got 218 miles on day one and 200 miles on day two
The GT3 owner and I swapped cars for one of the sessions; oh my, does that motor have some nice power! A Cayman GT3 would be a most awesome toy!

Man, the GT3 moves around a lot laterally compared to a Cayman/Boxster; must be that weight in the rear. I suppose a tighter suspension would help cure most of that. Still, there is nothing like the stability of a mid-engined car.

Porsche, please build a Cayman GT3!
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Old 06-28-2008, 04:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mooty View Post
With regard to the race, the yellow 911 with a great save was being chased by a BLACK (not red) 996GT3 driven by a former caymanite, Bob.

There was only ONE cup car. The other was a street 996GT3 driven by me,

Sorry, my eyesight and memory are not what they used to be. I recall it was exciting...the details I filled in.

Quote:
Andrew is a great coach. He taught me how to drive.
Andrew was a lot of fun to drive with, and he takes teaching seriously: He wanted me to get out to the T9 berm very early and very close--a scary proposition if you've not done that before. Apparently I was not being aggressive enough, perhaps still 2 feet off the berm. So on one lap he reaches over and holds the steering wheel as I make my turn in, so I don't turn in too far. We drift out to the edge of the berm, early, close and parallel. Nice. I had one of my 'inappropriate emotional responses': I started laughing and laughing. What a hoot that was! Next lap I got it right myself.
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Old 06-28-2008, 05:00 AM
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I think in California they allocate liability by relative negligence. The M3 driver should not have been distracted by the indicator light an the GT3 driver should have seen the other car and/or not been passing aggressively on blind corner when car on front was offline / behaving oddly. For good measure, the track, the organizers, BMW and Porsche would probably get dragged in if big $$ were at stake.

Since it was not a race, hopefully the two insurance companies will simply duke it out. I assume the M3 will come out fine, but the RS guy will get screwed because insurance company won't want to pay replacement value (MSRP+$40K or whatever), they will want to pay a depreciated value (MSRP - 25%).

-Chris
upon entering the track, you signed a waiver.
if you plan to call your insurance company (other than track specific ins.) please stay off track. **** happens on track. engines blow up, ppl make mistake, oil gets drop. drivers end up sueing each other or ins company sues each other... an experienced track driver knows the risks and do so by choice. if you think you will not have an incident, then please stay off track, you WILL get hit or hit something. it's a matter of when not if.
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